"We must be much more present in education through as the training of imams."
To believe the official figures, nearly 200 Belgians currently jihad in Iraq and Syria and hundreds fought and income. In proportion to population, it is the largest European contingent. Frontline as France, the country recently dismantled a cell that was about to strike on its soil. Audrey Tilve, our correspondent in Brussels, talks with Belgian Foreign Minister Didier Reynders. It also addresses the deteriorating situation in the east of Ukraine and the renegotiation of Greek debt.
Audrey Tilve euronews:
"Didier Reynders, we talk a lot in your country at this time because it is - just as France -very affected by the terrorist threat. We will talk about ways to deal with it but first, how do you explain that your country is one of the main centers of jihadism in Europe? "
Didier Reynders, Belgian Minister of Foreign Affairs:
"We are in a country with diverse communities very important but also we conduct a daily work to identify (jihadists). I do not know, in statistics, it's always the same thing, if everyone did this work in the same way. So I hope that in all European countries, it was even followed that allowed us there are still a few days to conduct police operations and intercept groups before they pass to the act, which is nevertheless essential. We have relatively large home but we follow closely, and I repeat, this is probably precisely what makes the difference is that we have a fairly accurate identification of those at risk. "
Audrey Tilve:
"So to try to prevent or combat terrorism more effectively, several European countries have made a lot of proposals such as to deprive the jihadists or candidates jihad passport, identity card, or even the nationality of the countries. There is also talk of giving citizenship classes of schoolchildren or secular morality. One has the impression of a stack fault surface measurements better. Do all that, it will really be effective? "
Didier Reynders:
"It's very important to remove the passports, identity cards withdraw, not as identification - indeed given another card, this is what we want to do, to another document - but as a travel document. It is preventing people to circulate freely even if the indications are clear about their dangerousness. That's the approach. And then you mentioned something else, it is the prevention of radicalism, radicalization. And then we must act where people really are the means of action. Prisons, it is also a very effective approach to isolate ... "
Audrey Tilve:
"Group fanatics them, you think this is a good solution? "
Didier Reynders:
"Oh, of course, absolutely, to have specific areas for them, because it prevents them from being in contact with young people or older people who would otherwise be in prison radicaliseraient strongly in prison. "
Audrey Tilve:
"However, they will be in contact with each other. "
Didier Reynders:
"Not necessarily, you can have insulation systems in cells. But in any case, they are already radicals, for me they can stay together, they should at least not infect others. This is the first step to take. The second measure, when you talk about education. It is the whole process of saying how to learn ... "
Audrey Tilve:
"So does that give such citizenship classes, it can compensate for failure of parental education or is it that it can prevent the indoctrination? "
Didier Reynders:
"There are two things we should do at home, and the Belgian situation is not the French situation is not the situation in other countries. With us, first of all, we must be much more present in education through as the training of imams. We have no specific training in Belgium for those who practice but are mainly responsible for the Muslim Faith, as there is to the Catholic religion or secular morality. And then the other thing is the young. With us, we have a rather special situation as inherited from our history. There are religious classes in schools. But in an official school, children are separated to go each follow a different religion courses. What one has to do obviously is to leave them together in a class and try to talk them not only to citizenship, but the history of religions, the ability to live together even when we have different beliefs. But that are not solutions to avoid an attack next week. These are solutions that will maybe take generations to repair - which is true - the failures which have occurred in how to organize the living together of several communities. "
Audrey Tilve:
"We heard some Muslims in our country include the plight of Palestinians, Iraqis, Afghans, to relativize the attacks in Paris. There is a true porosity of these crises, the fate of these people, and balance in our societies. So is this it, it's not going to change Belgian politics, or perhaps European policy on emblematic cases such as the Israeli-Palestinian conflict? "
Didier Reynders:
"I really wish there was a stronger presence of the EU in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Too often, we stayed on the second line, leaving the lead only to Americans. We must work together in this endeavor. But it must first between Israelis and Palestinians, we can talk again. By cons, what happened in Paris, it reminds us anyway other things. It is true that journalists, cartoonists, were killed because they were developing their freedom of expression. Police, it is because they represent authority. But Jews are killed simply because they are Jews. And one can not excuse or find reasons whatsoever for such acts, whether social or that they originate in conflicts around the world. "
Audrey Tilve:
"I would now like mentioned the situation in Ukraine is getting worse. He was seen with the attack on Mariupol. The Europeans hoped that the economic difficulties of Russia Vladimir Putin would compel change its position, it is not. What do you think is the outcome in Ukraine, do you see one? "
Didier Reynders:
"Vis-à-vis Russia, increase the pressure. This is done through sanctions, economic sanctions, but also through individual sanctions on individuals, on entities. And we must do so by trying to see how to keep a number of open channels for discussion with Russia. "
Audrey Tilve:
"Mr. Reynders's been a year we try to combine firmness and attempt to dialogue, and it did not much, it is longer than 5,000 deaths in Ukraine ..."
Didier Reynders:
"We must continue the current solution to the greatest possible pressure on Russia. "
Audrey Tilve:
"Is that the scenario of the partition of Ukraine remains taboo for you? Because in reality, this is what is happening: Vladimir Putin is trying to realize his concept of Novo Rossia, Russia expanded. "
Didier Reynders:
"That's what he wants to do. What we want is that Ukraine reform and takes account of all its components. And Ukraine, is one of the issues. It is likely that a number of people do not feel represented and certainly felt was not represented in the past by the power of Kiev. So there is a real work on this aspect there. But that does not prevent one must maintain the territorial integrity and sovereignty of Ukraine. "
Audrey Tilve:
"A word about Greece, which is at the heart of European news. The new government will ask its European partners to erase a portion of its debt, to repay the rest over a longer period, freezing the payment of interest for some time. Is Belgium is ready to access some of these requests? "
Didier Reynders:
"So the first thing, Greece, whatever its governments must respect its commitments. So what we initially expected the new Greek government is that it fulfills its commitments ... "
Audrey Tilve:
"That's to say?"
Didier Reynders:
"That is to say, to return to a healthier situation. So if the new Greek government comes with demands for that lengthens the repayment periods, so that we find amenities like these, it is always possible ... "
Audrey Tilve:
"So yes to a deferral of payment but not the deletion of part of the debt?"
Didier Reynders:
"Not just the questioning of all the commitments made by Greece itself. A government must respect what was agreed ... "
Audrey Tilve:
"You yourself have long been Minister of Finance. You know that 180% of debt is unsustainable and that if we do not get concessions, in the end, there will be the Greek default to the detriment of creditors who are mainly European countries and therefore European taxpayers. Do we want to get there? "
Didier Reynders:
"What strikes me most is that in the current debate is between Greece to Europe. This is not Europe that is in front of Greece, these are all European taxpayers. When we say Are you ready to erase the debt of Greece, it means you are ready to ask a French, a German, a Belgian, to pay the debt of Greece. I believe that this is not how we work. Even the International Monetary Fund, it has often spread heavily debt of Argentina or other debts, but asking in the race after return to balance and to be able one day to repay. So it is precisely this balance must be found. The new government to tell us both what he wants but he is willing to do internally in Greece. "
Audrey Tilve:
"Sir, thank you for having us. "
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